Coronavirus
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One thing I've never understood from the beginning of this is if the disease is so infectious and deadly, why are there jillions of people dead in China? Those people are packed in like sardines in the cities over there.
I fully realize their socialist/communist/whatever the hell they are now government is going to bury the truth about how many people croaked out but there are so many American and European corporate interests over there at this point, there's NO WAY they could hide the numbers that should be dead. If nothing else they should be smelling the tens of millions of rotting corpses in Japan by now, right?
China acted pretty fast, and the Wuhan/China lockdown was in place about 3 weeks after the disease was discovered. and has been said, with their government, REALLY locked down. New York City metro area, which is about the size of Wuhan, took the same amount of time to lock down after the first reported case. its obvious that not everyone listened or at lease adopted the ideas slowly. considering the spread of the virus is exponential (one sick person gets multiple more people sick), at least a week of delay, and likely under-reported China cases, I think the difference in cases between New York (240,000) and China (90,000) is not unusual.
you also seem to be ignoring the fact that measures are being done to stop the spread, and in our fast-communicating world, it has helped. people keep saying its not that bad and conveniently ignore that the measures (like social distancing) in place are why. read about the flu epidemic of 1918. it was equally as contagious, but actually less deadly (percentage of people who got the disease and survived was higher). we have history and experience with a pandemic like this. experts arent just making shit up, it's happened before. we dont have millions of people dead because of the measures that have been put in place. do you really need to see millions of people dead to start thinking "oh shit this is a problem".
Dan
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To trust anything being reported out of China is foolish
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For the exact reason you said. It's a communist country. They lock everything down and tell people to stay inside and they do it. Disease can't spread if no one is outside to spread it.
Got your point, still don't understand given the population density in those cities how it couldn't spread like wildfire before they realized they needed to go on full lockdown. And to reiterate, I don't believe their numbers, but it just seems it would have been so out of control by the time they went on lockdown, they wouldn't have been able to hide what was going on.
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and here we go. Safer in handcuffs
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and here we go. Safer in handcuffs
I was at the rally on Friday at the Capital. The police told the early arrivals to leave about a half hour before it started and they were just ignored. They backed down and let it go on with no interference. It would have been tough to ticket/arrest 2000+ people...
It's hard to say your grounds for arresting someone when what you are saying is the constitution is suspended because someone defines it as emergency times.
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I was at the rally on Friday at the Capital.
RIP
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If this goes against everything this country was created for and she (the woman who opened her business) ends up infecting & killing someone, then she should get charged with murder. You can’t have it both ways, while thinking you are not privileged.
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If this goes against everything this country was created for and she (the woman who opened her business) ends up infecting & killing someone, then she should get charged with murder. You can’t have it both ways, while thinking you are not privileged.
I think you are missing the part where nobody has to go to the store if they don't want to ...
Should WalMart be charged with murder if someone gets Covid19 there? That is following the same logic as your statement.
If I was 80 years old I would probably stay home and ask a healthy friend to drop stuff off for me. I'm 30 and healthy so I am not worried about it. I am also not visiting anyone that might be at risk.
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I think you are missing the part where nobody has to go to the store if they don't want to ...
Should WalMart be charged with murder if someone gets Covid19 there? That is following the same logic as your statement.
If I was 80 years old I would probably stay home and ask a healthy friend to drop stuff off for me. I'm 30 and healthy so I am not worried about it. I am also not visiting anyone that might be at risk.
Not missing anything, I said if she ends up infecting and killing someone. Don’t assume my logic applies to to corporations the same way.
You have to understand that this is a state law set by the government, dumber laws that are harmless have worse consequences. People who whine about the economy and getting back to work are the real chumps.
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Not missing anything, I said if she ends up infecting and killing someone. Don’t assume my logic applies to to corporations the same way.
You have to understand that this is a state law set by the government, dumber laws that are harmless have worse consequences. People who whine about the economy and getting back to work are the real chumps.
So a corporation has immunity and a small business does not?
I am challenging they notion that it makes sense to have a massive building packed with people like Walmart or similar stores but yet a lady doing curbside drop off of a pet is dangerous and needs to be arrested?
What is really going on here is that if a governor tried to make all Walmart's in their state close they would be at the wrong end of a lawsuit within hours.
You do realize that about 647,000 people in the USA died from heart disease last year? That is 12,400 in a week. Ref
So should we ban McDonald's? Cigarettes? Shut the country down? Let's get started solving that problem!
Read here to find that the week of 4/11 had the worst death toll for Covid19 and it was 11,468. Therefore the worst week of Covid19 was not even what the average week of people dying of heart disease, and last week was down to 1,078. The media likes to use sensational numbers but that is baseless and unhelpful like a graph with no units.
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Read here to find that the week of 4/11 had the worst death toll for Covid19 and it was 11,468. Therefore the worst week of Covid19 was not even what the average week of people dying of heart disease, and last week was down to 1,078. The media likes to use sensational numbers but that is baseless and unhelpful like a graph with no units.
lol, more trolling
Dan
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lol, more trolling
Both links are right to the CDC website, It's not just CNN, FOX or other unreliable sources.
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If this goes against everything this country was created for and she (the woman who opened her business) ends up infecting & killing someone, then she should get charged with murder. You can’t have it both ways, while thinking you are not privileged.
As of 4/29/20 @8:00am her curbside service for dog grooming is now “legally” able to operate.
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You do realize that about 647,000 people in the USA died from heart disease last year? That is 12,400 in a week. Ref
So should we ban McDonald's? Cigarettes? Shut the country down? Let's get started solving that problem!
Read here to find that the week of 4/11 had the worst death toll for Covid19 and it was 11,468. Therefore the worst week of Covid19 was not even what the average week of people dying of heart disease, and last week was down to 1,078. The media likes to use sensational numbers but that is baseless and unhelpful like a graph with no units.
That's a pretty subjective comparison, though.The worst weekly death toll for covid is with a stay at home order and businesses everywhere closed. Had that not been implemented, and the government said to carry on with all of your normal behaviors and don't change anything, I would ASSUME that number would significantly higher.
And there's too many variables in heart disease to use that as a broad comparison to this by saying we should ban mcdonalds, cigarettes, etc.
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Both links are right to the CDC website, It's not just CNN, FOX or other unreliable sources.
Please tell me you know the difference between heart disease and COVID-19. You know that high blood pressure, congenital heart disease, arrhythmia, heart attacks, etc. they're not contagious, right? You know that many aren't 100% preventable and can typically be effectively managed through medication, healthy diet and genetic luck... right? That deaths caused by these diseases is either due to neglect over years and years, a shortened lifespan in which that person was still able to live a long life after a diagnosis or genetic misfortune, right? You know that the danger of COVID-19 is it's ability to spread rapidly throughout the world within a matter of months let alone how quickly it can take over a town, county, etc., right?
Here's a shitty map I made quickly based on the positive cases since the beginning of April by county illustrating where the positive case growth is. Data provided by the Wisconsin DHS, not an unreliable source. As you'll notice the greatest rate of growth this month has been outside of the large metro areas and moved into rural counties. Based on this data I say we shut down the rural counties.
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I honestly dont know where I stand on the whole thing. Like EVERYTHING there are two sides to it, there is no one correct answer that works best for all, and I see things both ways. I think the plan set in place is a fair attempt to strike some sort of balance of safety and economic advancement.
Im keeping an eye on Georgia's stats over the next couple weeks to see if things blow up over there.
While we are at it, just be cause someone disagrees with you doesn't mean they hate you.
I use "you" universally.
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I honestly dont know where I stand on the whole thing. Like EVERYTHING there are two sides to it, there is no one correct answer that works best for all, and I see things both ways. I think the plan set in place is a fair attempt to strike some sort of balance of safety and economic advancement.
Im keeping an eye on Georgia's stats over the next couple weeks to see if things blow up over there.
While we are at it, just be cause someone disagrees with you doesn't mean they hate you.
I use "you" universally.
No. Please pick one side or the other, communicate in your personalized online echo chamber, and whatever you do, do not listen to any differing opinion towards your own whatsoever.
Thank you,
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No. Please pick one side or the other, communicate in your personalized online echo chamber, and whatever you do, do not listen to any differing opinion towards your own whatsoever.
Thank you,
How dare you reject my opinion.
I challenge you to fisticuffs!
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Please tell me you know the difference between heart disease and COVID-19. You know that high blood pressure, congenital heart disease, arrhythmia, heart attacks, etc. they're not contagious, right? You know that many aren't 100% preventable and can typically be effectively managed through medication, healthy diet and genetic luck... right? That deaths caused by these diseases is either due to neglect over years and years, a shortened lifespan in which that person was still able to live a long life after a diagnosis or genetic misfortune, right? You know that the danger of COVID-19 is it's ability to spread rapidly throughout the world within a matter of months let alone how quickly it can take over a town, county, etc., right?
Here's a shitty map I made quickly based on the positive cases since the beginning of April by county illustrating where the positive case growth is. Data provided by the Wisconsin DHS, not an unreliable source. As you'll notice the greatest rate of growth this month has been outside of the large metro areas and moved into rural counties. Based on this data I say we shut down the rural counties.
I'm quite aware that heart disease is different than a virus, I am not downplaying the seriousness. It is unfortunate that anyone has died. Just getting out of bed in the morning has risks.
I would argue that the curve seems flattened if the deaths have dropped off (I do realize that that 1,078 number may increase due to late reporting). Someone from a hard hit area comments here. https://nypost.com/2020/04/27/ive-worked-the-coronavirus-front-line-and-i-say-its-time-to-start-opening-up/?fbclid=IwAR1U0QhtJHbhXyG_iYsQIy5Ff9B_yhqe970-YAH2SyOeHw30JcEira6vGnw I'm not sure his source but said that 43% of people tested in the Bronx are positive. A big missing data point is actual numbers about how many people have or have had Covid19.
My interpretation of the numbers from testing in Wisconsin is that the only people being tested are severe cases. @patsbimmer1 from your map it appears Rock county has above average testing and it is still barely over 1% of the population. And that is why death percentages using positive case numbers and death numbers is vastly misleading. My mother in law clearly had it (father in law was tested positive and she was sick as well) but she was not tested, just told to quarantine. However if she had died she would have been tested and added to the death tally.
How many people are dying from the quarantine itself? How long do we continue just printing money to hand out? Printing money only causes all of the money to be worth less. It isn't all roses to keep "non-essential" businesses closed. Many will be gone for good, and along with them people's future plans,
I think antibody testing is what needs to happen. What if I had it and was asymptomatic? The only way to catch it on a virus test is to test everyone in the state every week and that wouldn't catch past cases, and also is not logistically possible. But an antibody test would determine all of who has already had it to evaluate when enough people have had it that herd immunity will be reached.
I'm not hating anyone, just sharing my opinion on the internet
I'll still cruise BMW's with anyone whether you agree with me or not. -
@jc43089 the flaw with only looking at death rate is the death does not occur without the virus so if positive cases slow down then the death rate should also slow down pending a freak outbreak in a retirement community or something similar. And again, the instance with your in-laws shows that rural communities are under reporting and could have a much higher rate of infection but we won't know for various reasons (lack of available care, lack of transportation, stubbornness, etc.). Also, if she would have passed and actually been tested and tested positive it doesn't just go in one column. It would be 1 positive case, 1 death. Increased testing would be great but again, that testing drops off drastically in rural communities where access to testing would be limited or difficult to get. An antibody test would be great but there are multiple forms of corona virus that create similar anti-bodies so this doesn't determine if someone has had it and doesn't help track spread.
As far as people dying due to quarantine, that's an ridiculous question because that would never show up as a cause of death. And how does someone die from quarantine? Lack of self care? Lack of food/water? Suicide? Other than suicide people aren't going to allow themselves to starve/dehydrate to the point of death. They'll break quarantine to survive. And if they were in such dire straights then quarantine or not they were on the extreme end of a spectrum.
I'm not saying we need to sit and print more money, that doesn't help the country long term. I'm not saying we need to quarantine longer. I understand the ramifications this has on small business better than most based on my interactions with 10-20 small businesses a day albeit in one sector. I am saying that i'd like you to provide a better argument for your reasoning as opposed to citing data that's completely irrelevant to the issue. I have a lot of respect for your opinion and enjoy hearing your perspective.
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